Blacks and gays

The interaction between black people and gay people is my favorite politically incorrect topic.

A bit of background is necessary. In previous decades, blacks kicked white people out of – what are now called – "historic black neighborhoods." These neighborhoods are generally neighborhoods close to the center of large cities. In recent decades, gays have begun kicking blacks out of these neighborhoods.

The "kicking out" processes are interesting. Blacks kicked out whites through a combination of increased crime, corrupt politics, and bad schools. Gays kick out blacks through increasing property values and new businesses that cater to people with high levels of disposable income. The latter process is generally referred to as "gentrification."

The final point worth mentioning is that blacks don’t like gays (HT: Richard Spencer, who adds some good thoughts along the same lines). You’re not supposed to discuss this particular point, but it’s very true.

I see this process in action every day, and it makes me very sympathetic to gays.

(Also noteworthy is the this Times article on DC gentrification, which studiously avoids mentioning gays).


12 Responses to Blacks and gays

  1. Lester Hunt says:

    I teach at an American university and consequently will not touch this topic with a ten foot pole.

  2. Erik says:

    The former process would be “detroitification”, right?

  3. Handle says:

    I remember in the California Proposition-8 polling that Blacks voted against the gays by 70% – the highest margin of any group, and were perhaps determinative of the result because of their high, Obama-enthusiasm-based, voter turnout. Not like that results matter because, as everyone expected, the California Supreme Court quickly ordered the vote nullified.

    At any rate, my feeling is that the bulk of inner-city Blacks aren’t necessarily all that attached to their particular urban neighborhoods, it’s just where they’re stuck without better options. When the rare better-option shows up, they quickly move without much sentimentality. This happened in the mass movement from South Chicago to Milwaukee in the “Welfare Magnet” effect described in Jason DeParle’s American Dream. Combined with the ban on discriminating against non-residents in Shapiro v. Thompson (Warren Court, 1969, ‘natch) was the real reason why Tommy Thompson’s “workfare” welfare reform started in Wisconsin which eventually led to the Federal PRWORA under Clinton.

    But the Black Urban system is very destructively co-dependent.

    The Democratic Black politicians depend on there being a black-majority within the obsolete political-boundaries of the municipality (The latest trend is that they want the actual majority living in the surrounding suburbs to pony up cash in some tax-sharing schemes for ‘downtown revitalization’ (kickback make-work programs), but, of course, they don’t want any of those people to vote). The Black public-employees and contractors depend on those politicians for the corrupt patronage machine system, and the rest of the Black community depends on both the above groups to allocate various welfare benefits. All of it depends, of course, on oodles of both State and Federal money from the outside keeping the whole thing afloat. I read somewhere that over 90% of Detroit’s GDP is now net-derived from government spending and transfers. That’s basically like a “foreign-aid” program.

    Once one masters the local welfare system, one is effectively a immobilized serf – which is, actually, part of the design. Consider the bizarre Section-8 and Medicaid enrollment systems. Instead of distributing by need, it’s a “limited quota” system of first-come, first-served which you cannot usually take with you if you move away. This is what led to the recent mass-sprint for benefits in Texas (you’ve got to see the video, search for “scramble for Dallas County rental vouchers”. The horrible irony is that it all took place at the “Jesse Owens Memorial Complex” who won Gold, of course, in the 100 and 200-meter dashes.)

    The true tragedy of the whole fiasco is that you have masses of Blacks who can’t move away (even to places with jobs and cheaper costs of living), and you have an entire spoils system apparatus dependent on no one else moving in despite the potential desirability of the location. Anything that might actually improve the situation for the local residents might also attract newcomers who would big up prices and drive them out, which threatens every tentacle of the beast – so the incentive is to keep things just awful enough to preserve the status-quo.

    But, once again, just look at the political savvy of those Chicago “Boystown” Gays. They don’t need to form “Death Wish” vigilante-justice groups (and I’m not sure they could or would even if they did). They’ve got the paper and television press reporting, they’ve got the social-media campaign going, they’re out in numbers with petitions trying to pressure the police and politicians, etc.

    I said before that we need to study, observe, and learn how they are doing all this (as we still should), but it has occurred to me that perhaps they just cannot be copied. How are they really able to get away with all this? Because, being gays, they are another specially-protected identity group which completely confuses the Blues and they can’t figure out which side to support. The gays can rally against their victimization by blacks (so long as they don’t get too explicit about it, without being immediately accused of being evil racists – which works as an effective suppression against everyone else.

    So, in the end, Spencer and you are probably right – we’ll just have to accept the Gays as the only group that is politically-immunized enough to be the “Storm Troopers” of our mutually-beneficial, multi-generational gentrification “take back the urban core” project. It’s like they have a magical superpower – Normal SWPL’s just put on the Ring-of-Gayness and suddenly Evil Dr. Blue cannot paralyze them with his Racism-Slander-Ray (though there are certain other side-effects).

    Finally, I’m not actually opposed to the idea of temporarily subsidizing new mostly (or even exclusively) Black communities if that’s what they would prefer – so long as the communities are developed to emerge socially-functional and capable of true independence, self-reliance, and responsibility (what I think you would call “True Freedom”). We should encourage them to build their own “Micro-Zions” the way they best see fit.

  4. interesting connection.

    i remember prop 8 in california when i lived there. everyone thought it would pass for sure, except black people.

    i have my own gay/black connection of sorts here, but the post is more about how special interest groups like gays are protected under the PC umbrella, doing stuff that is technically against their own dogmas if it is for their benefit, same as feminists and other groups.

    first time commenter…. i’ll have to be back

  5. Handle says:

    I wonder if you could make a list of fundamental tensions in the makeup of the evolving views of the Blue Coalition? Like the Marxists said, “Heighten the Contradictions”.

    1. SWPL’s+Gays vs. Blacks for the future of the Urban Core.
    2. Unions vs. Hispanics on immigration and labor.
    3. Unions vs. NAMs on Affirmative Action / Diversity Hiring and Promotion.
    4. Unions vs. Big Companies on Free Trade and Outsourcing.
    5. Unions vs. Environmentalists on new projects and job creation.
    6. NAMs vs. Big Finance on Debt-issuance matters.
    7. Teachers v. the whole Utopian Education-Reform Crowd on testing and performance pay.
    8. Mostly white Senior citizens collecting Social Security and Medicare and blowing up the National Debt vs. Young, heavily-NAM population of tax-payers and future burden-carriers.
    9. State Public Sector Employees vs. Medicaid and other mandatory state-budget busting programs which suck the money out of their agencies’ budgets and get them fired.
    10. Elite, wealthy intelligentsia vs largely low-prole base in terms of divergence of interests and culture.

    Ok – crowdsource time – what else? Can the wedges be sharpened into axes? Is this just “FDR Coalition” vs. “New Left” in their organizing principles, or is it more? My sense is that Industrial-Workers Unions are gradually fading in importance as they shrink and vampirically suck the competitive life-blood out of the hosts upon which they depend for sustenance (see, UAW) – but that’s still a decent chunk of the population.

  6. Fake Herzog says:


    Complicating the story somewhat, as I said on a previous blog, is the fact that the victim was himself black and gay (and the perp may have been gay as well, although that is unclear):


    How about number 1.5) Hispanics vs. Blacks for the future of urban America?

  7. […] is creating a list of contradictions among the leftist coalition – see if you have any to […]

  8. International Jews like Barbara Spectre seeking to reduce Europe’s “monolithic demographics” vs. increased anti-Semitism as a result of increased Muslim immigration there

    Welfare as a safety net for poor blacks vs. welfare subsidizing black illegitimacy and other poor behavior

    Favoring abortion (which leads to more minority fetuses being aborted, proportionally speaking) vs. the right to choose
    Favoring gay marriage vs. the future slippery slope of considering NAMBLA marriage rights

    Israel as an ethno-state vs. Jewish calls for multiculturalism and diversity–which is a strength, in case you didn’t know

    Increasing diversity (because it’s a strength) vs. decreasing social capital and weakening civil society a la Robert Putnam

    Feminists lumping women with oppressed minorities vs. the fact that women outnumber men

    The difficulty in finding the most oppressed members as you scale the victimhood totem pole: poor, African, disabled, midget single-mother vs. poor, Hispanic, disabled, midget single-mother vs. poor, Jewish, disabled, midget single-mother etc.

    Inviting the third world to live in the first vs. decreasing the carbon footprint produced by the first world (hat tip to Sailer for that one)

    And just for fun, here’s a dilemma faced by the right:

    Allocating 20% of the budget to military spending (which works a lot like a subsidy for gas prices, thus allowing the middle class to get away from inner-city NAMs) vs. dramatically decreasing defense spending at the cost of paying higher gas prices (thus making it less convenient for the middle class to avoid culturally violent vibrant inner-city NAMs.)

  9. […] – “Blacks and Gays“, “I’m Underpaid“, “Tom Lamont“, “HBD, Taxes and […]

  10. Claudius says:

    A classic example of cognitive dissonance in the black vs. gay conflict occurred shortly after the Prop 8 vote, when Dan Savage was on the Colbert Report and asked about the black-voter turnout’s decisive effect on Prop 8. Savage spluttered for a moment and then shifted the blame to old people and wished aloud that old people would hurry up and die so that a new, gay-friendly utopia could be ushered in. Under no circumstances was Savage going to let blacks take any blame for the passage of Prop 8. It was quite revealing…and quite unintentionally comical.—dan-savage

    Colbert: “Is that what gay people are like–vicious?”

    Savage: “Yes, it is, actually”

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